THE EVIL MESSAGEBOARD Caution: Not for the faint of mind.    FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Login to check your private messages   Login  HELP ON INSTALLING AND USING RIVATUNER Goto page Previous  1, 2          THE EVIL MESSAGEBOARD Forum Index -> Audio/Video tech View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message Ailuros Joined: 21 Jun 2002 Posts: 49 Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2002    Post subject: Did it installed it successfully so I'm finally on 29.42 WHQL effectively. Concerning anisotropic my findings seem though to go along with those of Unwinder at nvnews: Quote: NV25 GPUs do have some AF related issues. It looks like fillrate drops drastically when more two (or more) textures are simultaneously filtered with AF. In this case the efficiency of multitexturing is equal to zero (i.e. multipass rendering performance is equal to singlepass multitexturing). This was already proved by 3DMark/SS fillrate tests. I've also created my own test D3D application to ensure that is' not the application's fault. I just rendered two isotropic textures in both single and multitexturing modes. The performance reduces significally (equal to multipass rendering) when AF is used for both textures, but it is MUCH higher when I disable AF for the second texturing stage. Furthermore, the GPU must _not_ use AF for isotropic textures at all, but NV25 do it (NV20 don't). I'm afraid that it's just a hardware feature (bug?) of this GPU and it will never be fixed by NVIDIA in new drivers. Don't tell me that it will be fixed coz NV already fixed OpenGL driver. They didn't fixed anything, AF was just optimized for all NVIDIA GPUs (and it's very said that they did it after discovering the problem only). The easiest way to work around this problem (NVIDIA, listen ) is to allow us to force AF on per-stage level. There is no need to use AF for all texturing stages (or texture units in OGL therminology) in the most of currently existing games. Why to filter secondary textures (usually light/reflection maps and so on)?! It's just a waste of fillrate, the difference in IQ will be hardly noticable. I assume that they already did such optimization in the OpenGL 28.90+, and there are some facts that confirm it: 1. Both anisotropy modes (slow/quality and fast) give the same performance in singletexturing mode, fast mode gives boost in conjunction with multitexturing only. 2. IQ differences in Q3 are noticable (but it was very difficult to find it ) on the lightmaps only. 3. It looks like they've experimented with D3D driver too - it contains encrypted D3D registry entry, which allows to limit the maximum degree of anisotropy for specified texturing stages for NV25 only. All this stuff allows me to assume that in fast mode they simplify filtering algorithm (disable anisotropy at all?) on some textures (far from camra?), filtered by non-primary texturing unit. Back to top Blighter Joined: 23 Jun 2002 Posts: 57 Location: Helsinki, Finland Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2002    Post subject: Gah. Sorry Ail Thank the heavens that I got NV15 Crap I'm just kidding, I want a new card. _________________ Blighter Back to top Ailuros Joined: 21 Jun 2002 Posts: 49 Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2002    Post subject: ROFL Unwinder is guestimating. What he misses is that in many occassions the drivers seem to simply shut multitexturing off, where you don't notice a performance difference. NV15? Look at it like that: q3a/demo 001/1024x768x32/bilinear 4xOGMS + texture sharpening LOD bias at 0.8 64-tap performance aniso: 82.3fps Back to top EvilEngine GODMODE Joined: 27 May 2002 Posts: 153 Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2002    Post subject: Hey AIL have you tried using the GF2 compatibility mode for supersampling aa? I have no idea if it works for GF4s or not. If not this is what you do to do it: Back to top Ailuros Joined: 21 Jun 2002 Posts: 49 Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2002    Post subject: I´ve seen it, and intended to just give it a whirl to see how it performs. If I wanted Supersampling I would have gotten a 8500 The tab is not greyed out so it should be working. In fact maybe I should try TNT compatibility too hahahaha One question: on default the drivers use 5mb of system textures for PCI in openGL and 47mb for D3D. Should I set them lower and if yes WHY? Back to top EvilEngine GODMODE Joined: 27 May 2002 Posts: 153 Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2002    Post subject: Ailuros wrote: I´ve seen it, and intended to just give it a whirl to see how it performs. If I wanted Supersampling I would have gotten a 8500 The tab is not greyed out so it should be working. In fact maybe I should try TNT compatibility too hahahaha One question: on default the drivers use 5mb of system textures for PCI in openGL and 47mb for D3D. Should I set them lower and if yes WHY? Depends on who you ask. Technically it shouldnt have any positive or negative effects on a AGP card, but some people still set it to "0"(as do I) Thats seems to be more of a placebo effect, and I have honestly never seen any changes that I can tell that come from changing this setting. So leave alone if you want. Another setting like this is the "use fast linear-mipmap-linear filtering" , and I really have never seen a visual or a fps change from that either. Back to top EvilEngine GODMODE Joined: 27 May 2002 Posts: 153 Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2002    Post subject: The supersampling is still handy to have since our vgas are flexable enough to do at least two types of AA(not counting quin) Early games that use lots of unoptimized alphas like MDK2, which really look sweet when using the compatibility mode. Fps still are well above 100+fps even with 2x+2x(maxed) and all the eye candy. Back to top Ailuros Joined: 21 Jun 2002 Posts: 49 Posted: Fri Jun 28, 2002    Post subject: Thanks EE. All FSAA modes are available on the NV25 including 4-9tap, which admittedly combined with any degree of aniso is quite slow, unless you drop resolution which I refuse to heh. Between 2x/4x MSAA and Quin/4-9tap, I of course prefer the former two modes by far, yet the latter are not completely useless for all occassions. Quincunx does not blur as much as it did in the past, but the blur is still there. Combined with a balanced negated LOD setting though it´s not as bad as everyone makes it out to be. People are probably just too scared to admit it because of the criticism it received and the post filtering problem that doesn´t allow to reproduce accurate IQ in screenshots. As far as I can tell the bluring/clarity on screenshots differences appear mostly on text and hardly on the scenery. Although SS:SE isn´t a game I would play with quin on, notice how the framecounter or the red number in the center are correctly reproduced, in contrary to the statistical numbers on the right side (by the way there´s no LOD negated for that one): The output of the scenery looks identical to me as in in game conditions. Oh yeah my monitor sucks as someone else would say *wink wink* Back to top EvilEngine GODMODE Joined: 27 May 2002 Posts: 153 Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2002    Post subject: I see we have LOTS of guests that have visited from B3D. Come on guys and gals your welcomed to register, and post too Anyways, glad all of you stopped by to check this place out, now I have to get my admin to pump up the bandwidth limits for this domain LMAO. Back to top Display posts from previous: All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First         THE EVIL MESSAGEBOARD Forum Index -> Audio/Video tech All times are GMT Goto page Previous  1, 2 Page 2 of 2   Jump to: Select a forum TECHNICAL----------------Audio/Video techWindows SupportLINUX Support GAMER'S HALL----------------PC GamingCONSOLE Gaming OPEN TALK----------------Daily LifeComplaints/SuggestionsAlternative News  You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum Powered by phpBB 2.0.1 © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group